Simu Liu jumps from the action-packed Marvel Cinematic Universe to the wondrous world of Barbie. The Canadian actor of Chinese origin plays a version of Ken — with Ryan Gosling playing the primary Ken to Margot Robbie’s Barbie — in Greta Gerwig’s big summer blockbuster Barbie that releases in theatres globally on July 21.

Even as the buzz around Barbie grows by the day with brands across the world going into an overdrive to channel the world and the ethos of the big-budget multistarrer, produced by Warner Bros, Simu Liu, 34, is touring the world with his team of the film to promote their much-anticipated biggie.

The actor, of course, is not new to tentpole releases, having embodied the title role in the 2021 MCU box-office blockbuster Shang-Chi and the Legend of the Ten Rings. Having started off in comedy and as a stunt man, Liu is a man of many talents, whose talent for dance — bhangra to freestyle — makes him a shoo-in for the film.

Over a cross-continental call, t2oS spoke to the articulate actor on being Ken in Barbie, how diversity matters to him (and the film) and why he can’t wait to break into Bollywood!

There is so little that we know about the plot of Barbie and hence every piece of information that comes out about the film is lapped up instantly. In the chatter that’s been going around and as we approach release date, what’s the predominant tenor of what people are looking forward to in this much-anticipated film?

You are absolutely right! There has been so much curiosity all over the world about what this movie is. With every piece of news, every announcement, with every trailer that drops, it feels so unexpected. I felt that way too when I was first introduced to the project. I was told that Greta Gerwig was directing and Margot Robbie was producing... it really perked my ears up right away.

Honestly, it’s very easy to be cynical about these big-budget movies, especially one like this which is based on a big toy brand. There is this sense of: ‘Really?! They are making that movie?’ We are all cynics at the end of the day.

But then you hear the names of all the people who are involved and the creatives that are shaping the story and you just go: ‘Okay, I want to see what this is about.’ I think the trailers have done a really, really good job of teasing some of the really fun elements of the movie. There is obviously a lot of pink (laughs), the production design is absolutely incredible, the outfits and the fashion and the dancing and music. But I think people will be quite surprised when they see the movie. There is a depth to it and a heart to it that I think hasn’t been communicated in the trailers yet. I think the film is going to touch a lot of hearts.

So what was your first reaction when you were approached to play Ken in a Barbie film? Did that invite any cynicism or were you like: ‘Bring it on!’

It was definitely more of a ‘bring it on’ situation. I love physical challenges. My last film Shang-Chi (and the Legend of the Ten Rings) was very, very physically demanding. After reading the Barbie script, I knew that there would be a lot of dancing. In my first meeting with Greta, I spoke about my dance background. I love to dance! I was part of a competitive dance team in university... a hip-hop dance troupe. By the way, I am just putting it out there that I would love to do something in Bollywood (laughs). Bollywood dances are so phenomenal! I would love to — okay, let me change that — I need to do a dance number in Bollywood....

We would love to have you here!

Thank you for saying that! So when Greta told me how much importance dance would have in Barbie, I just lit up! Honestly, I think that was a big part of what landed me the role. It was such a fun process to learn the choreography and then execute it.

I believe that playing Ken also involved a whole lot of painful waxing!

Ya, ya! The thing is that dolls don’t have body hair! (Laughs) Dolls would actually be very weird with body hair... it would be so uncomfortable to hold them. So one of the things I was told was that the hair had to go. For people who wax themselves regularly, they are a little bit more used to it; but for me and a lot of my fellow Kens, this was the first time when we had experienced that kind of waxing. Let me tell you... it was one of the most painful experiences of my life!

Simu Liu with Ryan Gosling at a fan event of Barbie in Toronto

New-found respect for women, is it?

Oh my God, yes! The pain that women have to go through with so many things... waxing, childbirth... I have so much respect!

What was it like being on the sets of Barbie?

It was much more than what I had expected it to be. We had some great people working on this film. Our production designer Sarah Greenwood did such an amazing job building these beautiful sets with lifelike dolls and doll houses. To just step into that world was nothing short of magic.

Greta is such a collaborative director. She really listens to ideas that one has and really makes it a safe space. Sometimes, directors just want to do it their way and it’s fine you know... at the end of the day, we are all there to service the story and the director is the captain of that ship. But it’s more of a fulfilling experience when everybody — whether it’s the cast or crew — feel like they matter and that they are listened to. On this set, we not only got to enact the script and say the lines, but also provide ideas.

This film also makes a great case for diversity. Apart from the wide-ranging variety of Barbies and Kens, I believe that even among the dancers, a lot of care was taken to keep it inclusive. What can you tell us about that?

Yeah, absolutely! This film is an embodiment of the commitment made by Greta and (producer) Warner Bros. A real effort has been made to ensure that Barbie Land feels like it was made for everyone. I think a very common — and a very earned criticism — of Barbie over the years is that it has reflected one very narrow standard of beauty, which has often been unrealistic... blond haired, blue-eyed.... But the brand has now evolved, and this movie really jumps into the conversation and it says: ‘No, we can do better’.

I love this self-awareness. Greta doesn’t shy away from that conversation. We present a Barbie Land that’s evolving, one which is representative of the world that we are in now. That’s really exciting and really speaks of Greta’s creativity and sensitivity as a film-maker.

Growing up, did you have an initial brush with Barbie or Ken?

I never really did. I grew up at a time when gender roles were really defined and very narrow. What a boy could wear, what a girl could wear were pre-determined, right down to the colours. Blue belongs to the boys, pink belongs to the girls, we were told. Boys played with action figures while girls had their Barbie dolls.

Looking back now, it really feels very exhausting and really restricting to put those roles into children’s minds so early on in their lives.

A big thing about the Barbie movie is its emphasis on embracing your shine, embracing who you really want to be and express yourself the way you want to. Wear the colours that you want, play with the toys that you fancy.... It’s just so refreshing to hear that.

Very liberating too...

Ya, exactly! I have seen more pink on this press tour than I ever had in my life! I love pink! It’s a great colour, it’s vibrant and fun...

And the world ran out of a certain tint of pink because Sarah Greenwood and her team used it so much in Barbie!

Hearing that doesn’t surprise me and when you watch the movie, even you won’t be surprised. There is a lot of pink in Barbie! The houses are pink, the sky is pink, even our beaches in the film are pink! So apologies to the rest of the world... we hope you will forgive us! (Laughs) But we needed to make Barbie Land the right way.

How has working on Barbie contributed to you as an actor as well as a performer?

When you work with people who are right at the top of their game, those who are masters at what they do, you automatically grow yourself. Ryan (Gosling, who plays the main Ken) and Margot are both Oscar-calibre actors and they lead our movie. The best of the best has worked on this film. It’s impossible to not learn by osmosis... just being on set with all of them and seeing them working and then being directed by someone like Greta Gerwig, who is really powerful in her choices and in the directions that she gives on set, is such a learning experience.

I started in comedy and I have such a love of comedy and SNL (Saturday Night Live), that being with Will Ferrell and Kate

McKinnon, who are such master improvisers, on the set of Barbie was incredible. It was a real honour to be on set with everyone. I soaked up all of that like a sponge and it was a privilege to get to play in the same sandbox as them.

Do you see diversity and inclusivity creeping in steadily into the roles that are being offered to you now?

For sure. Conversations are opening up more and even at this year’s Oscars, we had Everything Everywhere All At Once, which had a largely Asian cast, just obliterating everyone else and winning almost every award. I couldn’t be more proud watching, and I think it’s a sign that the topics that we are making in cinema are now really starting to change the conversation.

I can’t really be the kind of actor that just waits around and says: ‘Okay, where is my part?’ I have to be proactive and maybe one day step into the role of a producer and help put projects together. I want to give a platform to stories and voices, and even as an actor, I want to tell a wide range of stories that come from different cultures. That excites me about the future, and not just as an actor.

Is directing a film part of that exciting future?

I definitely have a curiosity for it. I think when the time is right, it will feel like it’s the right thing to do. I can’t jump the gun on it... I am too busy having fun right now as an actor, with Marvel and with Barbie and with everything else. But one day, I am going to step behind the camera and make a movie.

Since you spoke about wanting to work in Bollywood, what intrigues you so much about Bollywood? Have you recently watched anything out of India that had an impact on you?

The most recent one was RRR and it was phenomenal! Such great action and magical dance numbers. It’s unlike anything that we have in America or that I have witnessed in any other country’s cinema. Bollywood is so unique in its tone. There is such musicality to it and I think Bollywood actors have to be such incredible performers.

It’s so beautiful to do a Bollywood film, and at the same time, it’s such a challenge. For anyone who fancies a good challenge, who loves to sing, who loves to dance... Bollywood calls out to them. And I am going to say that Bollywood definitely calls to me. So please, I hope this interview helps me land a Bollywood film!